days_go_by
11-07 07:55 PM
Hello NJ members,
Please introduce yourself here.
I am a volunteer for IV, I live in Newport, Jersey City.
I have a May 2001 PD stuck at BEC and a 2004 PD labo approved but can't file 485.
Regards,
dgb.
Please introduce yourself here.
I am a volunteer for IV, I live in Newport, Jersey City.
I have a May 2001 PD stuck at BEC and a 2004 PD labo approved but can't file 485.
Regards,
dgb.
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kumarc123
03-12 08:33 AM
This should have been posted in DONOR's forum :)
I have a question for Paapu and IV?
WHAT are you all doing? you want our money and our involvement for what?
FOR THIS? ALSO DONOR FORUM IS FOR THIS?
Pappu if you cannot run this organization, please close it, but don't ask of any IV non donor to donate for the cause, I proposed to you about holding a rally, IT IS A SHAME this organization FAILED to do ANYTHING AFTER 2007.
ILLEGALS ARE BETTER THAN US, SHAME ON US.
AND SHAME ON YOU GUYS.
I have a question for Paapu and IV?
WHAT are you all doing? you want our money and our involvement for what?
FOR THIS? ALSO DONOR FORUM IS FOR THIS?
Pappu if you cannot run this organization, please close it, but don't ask of any IV non donor to donate for the cause, I proposed to you about holding a rally, IT IS A SHAME this organization FAILED to do ANYTHING AFTER 2007.
ILLEGALS ARE BETTER THAN US, SHAME ON US.
AND SHAME ON YOU GUYS.
senthil1
06-12 10:03 PM
Yes that is true. Impact for US companies are minimal and in fact good for US companies and more disadvantage for Indian companies. Mainly those who are running just by H1b persons will have tough time. Actually many small US consulting companies went out of business because they were not able to compete with Indian companies because of H1B.
dont count on the restrictions being removed, the restrictions are the trade off to the major increase that is goin to take place for the h1b's , the biggie US companys are not gonna get affected by them, its only the indian IT and the desi bodyshoppers, so they wil support it as long as they get the h1b's.
dont count on the restrictions being removed, the restrictions are the trade off to the major increase that is goin to take place for the h1b's , the biggie US companys are not gonna get affected by them, its only the indian IT and the desi bodyshoppers, so they wil support it as long as they get the h1b's.
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tinamatthew
07-24 01:02 PM
There is no doubt the employer letter is required.
The only question is:
1) is it safer to wait for RN and then submit this letter as evidence quoting the A# assigned, I think that would be wise for a concurrenly filed application. My lawyer said that if its concurrently filed, the letter accompanying the i-140 is sufficient and 2 letters are not required. But if the i-485 is on it own then an employment letter must accompany the form. OR
2) is it a better idea to submit a new I-485 rightaway along with the letter, What is reasoning behind this. Are you expecting a rejection? Why not wait for the RN and then send in the letter? Have you spoken to your lawyer?OR
3) should such people just wait hoping they will receive an RFE (I don't like this one at all) whenever the case is opened? For initial evidence items I believed that it would be automatically rejected if not included, HOWEVER, with the new press release from USCIS on July 23, if i-485s WITHOUT medical reports will be accepted, then what is an employment letter?
This is my 2c, but pls confirm with lawyer :)
The only question is:
1) is it safer to wait for RN and then submit this letter as evidence quoting the A# assigned, I think that would be wise for a concurrenly filed application. My lawyer said that if its concurrently filed, the letter accompanying the i-140 is sufficient and 2 letters are not required. But if the i-485 is on it own then an employment letter must accompany the form. OR
2) is it a better idea to submit a new I-485 rightaway along with the letter, What is reasoning behind this. Are you expecting a rejection? Why not wait for the RN and then send in the letter? Have you spoken to your lawyer?OR
3) should such people just wait hoping they will receive an RFE (I don't like this one at all) whenever the case is opened? For initial evidence items I believed that it would be automatically rejected if not included, HOWEVER, with the new press release from USCIS on July 23, if i-485s WITHOUT medical reports will be accepted, then what is an employment letter?
This is my 2c, but pls confirm with lawyer :)
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sc3
10-16 06:05 PM
What happened to your sense of judgment, whoever said that USCIS is doing it maliciously? They reacted for sure but within legal boundaries. I do not understand why you keep twisted people’s answers.
I havent twisted anyone's answers. When you (and others) say "reacted" you mean that they are intentionally shafting you in some way. Do you dispute that? Why is the very first response to this idea something to the tune of "..and see the cutoff go back to ice ages". It clearly shows that people are saying USCIS will "revolt" against you (not necessarily in as many words).
That is exactly I am saying, I am asking why should it be this way, this is totally wrong. They should go by PD. Even if my application was not moved to another centre mine still would not have gotten approved because I applied in Aug and not July. I mentioned that to tell you that I have to wait even more now.
Now if you ask me why I applied in Aug and not in Jul, it is because my family was not in US at that time. If you had told me beforehand about the impending fiasco I wouldn’t have sent them in the first place. I had to call them back and cancel my trip spending hundreds of $s.
Why is it not sustainable, now you are defending something that is wrong, why should I have to wait though my GC was started ages before?
Let's see here; I don't need to know why you did not apply earlier, that is your personal matter. But answer me this.
I have a PD of late 2002 (EB3), and haven't been able to apply due to personal reasons. Now when the PD becomes current. I apply and the following bulletin further advances the PD. Do you think that I should be given preference over someone who had no personal obligations and applied in 2007, that is to say, should the entire system be ground to a halt because I am a late filer?
Now put yourself in the earlier RD's applicant? What will be your answer? Do you think someone who delays for personal reason be given a free pass just because he has an earlier PD??
I know you dont want to hear it, but the current system of RD based processing is a good system. Your grouse probably is that they advanced the PDs so much further when there was enough demand from earlier PDs. If you argue on that premise, I will be very supportive. But I am insensitive to "I have an earlier PD, so I should get my GC first".
PD has its place in the system, however it does not play a role in processing order.
Just because I said USCIS is doing something wrong (not following processing order..) doesn’t mean I said that DOS did something right.. you keep assuming things..
You were blaming USCIS for the Perm/BEC debacle, I did not assume anything you haven't already said.
Again you are running your imagination wild, who blamed all the other things on USCIS?..
I guess your computer has a bug, it is not showing the winkies and the smiles properly. Get a technician to look at it.
Dude, show me one post of mine which said anything against the idea. I even gave a green for what he is trying to do, at least he is doing something while the rest of us are watching….
I was responding to "bec", and you ended up debating the issue by supporting the idea that USCIS retaliated because of the July 07. I guess that makes it fair play for people to assume that you are against the original idea. I you consider it to be overreaching to make such connection, I apologize for that.
I havent twisted anyone's answers. When you (and others) say "reacted" you mean that they are intentionally shafting you in some way. Do you dispute that? Why is the very first response to this idea something to the tune of "..and see the cutoff go back to ice ages". It clearly shows that people are saying USCIS will "revolt" against you (not necessarily in as many words).
That is exactly I am saying, I am asking why should it be this way, this is totally wrong. They should go by PD. Even if my application was not moved to another centre mine still would not have gotten approved because I applied in Aug and not July. I mentioned that to tell you that I have to wait even more now.
Now if you ask me why I applied in Aug and not in Jul, it is because my family was not in US at that time. If you had told me beforehand about the impending fiasco I wouldn’t have sent them in the first place. I had to call them back and cancel my trip spending hundreds of $s.
Why is it not sustainable, now you are defending something that is wrong, why should I have to wait though my GC was started ages before?
Let's see here; I don't need to know why you did not apply earlier, that is your personal matter. But answer me this.
I have a PD of late 2002 (EB3), and haven't been able to apply due to personal reasons. Now when the PD becomes current. I apply and the following bulletin further advances the PD. Do you think that I should be given preference over someone who had no personal obligations and applied in 2007, that is to say, should the entire system be ground to a halt because I am a late filer?
Now put yourself in the earlier RD's applicant? What will be your answer? Do you think someone who delays for personal reason be given a free pass just because he has an earlier PD??
I know you dont want to hear it, but the current system of RD based processing is a good system. Your grouse probably is that they advanced the PDs so much further when there was enough demand from earlier PDs. If you argue on that premise, I will be very supportive. But I am insensitive to "I have an earlier PD, so I should get my GC first".
PD has its place in the system, however it does not play a role in processing order.
Just because I said USCIS is doing something wrong (not following processing order..) doesn’t mean I said that DOS did something right.. you keep assuming things..
You were blaming USCIS for the Perm/BEC debacle, I did not assume anything you haven't already said.
Again you are running your imagination wild, who blamed all the other things on USCIS?..
I guess your computer has a bug, it is not showing the winkies and the smiles properly. Get a technician to look at it.
Dude, show me one post of mine which said anything against the idea. I even gave a green for what he is trying to do, at least he is doing something while the rest of us are watching….
I was responding to "bec", and you ended up debating the issue by supporting the idea that USCIS retaliated because of the July 07. I guess that makes it fair play for people to assume that you are against the original idea. I you consider it to be overreaching to make such connection, I apologize for that.
SGP
08-12 04:30 PM
I feel frustrated at some peoples' unwillingness to admit that EB3 needs IV's help now more than ever. They are saying that nothing much can be done for EB3, as INS merely corrected its wrong interpretation in visa allocation
But, if we are all willing to put our hearts and minds to it we can surely come up with new ideas that will help our cause. Surely, laws are written so that justice can happen. So if justice is not happening, the law would have some answer, somewhere.
Let me put forward my idea.
The INA language says that until EB2 is not current, there will be no spillover to EB3. Agreed. But I would contend that this statement is on a year to year basis. That is, if in the year 2002 (for example) all EB2 has been satisfied, then the spillovers should go to year 2002 EB3.
Is this something IV can point out and fight for? Can EB3 members put their money and efforts in this direction? Let me know if this sounds worthwhile
I Agree with you. Count me in.
But, if we are all willing to put our hearts and minds to it we can surely come up with new ideas that will help our cause. Surely, laws are written so that justice can happen. So if justice is not happening, the law would have some answer, somewhere.
Let me put forward my idea.
The INA language says that until EB2 is not current, there will be no spillover to EB3. Agreed. But I would contend that this statement is on a year to year basis. That is, if in the year 2002 (for example) all EB2 has been satisfied, then the spillovers should go to year 2002 EB3.
Is this something IV can point out and fight for? Can EB3 members put their money and efforts in this direction? Let me know if this sounds worthwhile
I Agree with you. Count me in.
more...
desi3933
02-11 01:57 PM
You rock dude!
Am I the only one to remember how visa numbers spill between FB and EB every other year? (or) Am I hallucinating?
Thanks so much for your kind words.
I don't blame readers who start making noise without basic verification. Most people have difficulty understanding the difference between cap and quota Or Permanent job vs W2 job.
_________________
Not a legal advice.
Am I the only one to remember how visa numbers spill between FB and EB every other year? (or) Am I hallucinating?
Thanks so much for your kind words.
I don't blame readers who start making noise without basic verification. Most people have difficulty understanding the difference between cap and quota Or Permanent job vs W2 job.
_________________
Not a legal advice.
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BharatPremi
03-12 12:02 PM
I am worried about this financial reports. I am not sure many consulting companies will give those to employee who is leaving
Yes, I believe, most companies (new employers - mid level) would not even ask and if requested and you can not provide then generally they may not make a big deal but underlying result for asking is to check if financial strength is "Good" and I-140 is approved then no problem hiring an EAD holder.
Yes, I believe, most companies (new employers - mid level) would not even ask and if requested and you can not provide then generally they may not make a big deal but underlying result for asking is to check if financial strength is "Good" and I-140 is approved then no problem hiring an EAD holder.
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Ramba
07-14 06:01 PM
Consult an attorney because if you applied for I-485 in July 2007 and quit employer in August, you might not be covered under AC21 since 6 months did not pass since adjucation request (I-485) was files with USCIS.
This is aboslutly incorrect. Dont spread false information.
Here is the Q&A in USCIS memo abot changing employer before 180 days
Question 10. Should service centers or district offices deny portability cases on the sole basis that the alien has left his or her employment with the I-140 petitioner prior to the I-485 application pending for 180 days?
Answer: No. The basis for adjustment is not actual (current) employment but prospective employment. Since there is no requirement that the alien have ever been employed by the petitioner while the I-140 and/or I-485 was pending, the fact that an alien left the I-140 petitioner before the I-485 has been pending 180 days will not necessarily render the alien ineligible to port. However, in all cases an offer of employment must have been bona fide. This means that, as of the time the I-140 was filed and at the time of filing the I-485 if not filed concurrently, the I-140 petitioner must have had the intent to employ the beneficiary, and the alien must have intended to undertake the employment, upon adjustment. Adjudicators should not presume absence of such intent and may take the I-140 and supporting documents themselves as prima facie evidence of such intent, but in appropriate cases additional evidence or investigation may be appropriate
This is aboslutly incorrect. Dont spread false information.
Here is the Q&A in USCIS memo abot changing employer before 180 days
Question 10. Should service centers or district offices deny portability cases on the sole basis that the alien has left his or her employment with the I-140 petitioner prior to the I-485 application pending for 180 days?
Answer: No. The basis for adjustment is not actual (current) employment but prospective employment. Since there is no requirement that the alien have ever been employed by the petitioner while the I-140 and/or I-485 was pending, the fact that an alien left the I-140 petitioner before the I-485 has been pending 180 days will not necessarily render the alien ineligible to port. However, in all cases an offer of employment must have been bona fide. This means that, as of the time the I-140 was filed and at the time of filing the I-485 if not filed concurrently, the I-140 petitioner must have had the intent to employ the beneficiary, and the alien must have intended to undertake the employment, upon adjustment. Adjudicators should not presume absence of such intent and may take the I-140 and supporting documents themselves as prima facie evidence of such intent, but in appropriate cases additional evidence or investigation may be appropriate
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sunty
11-11 09:37 AM
vin13,
This just beats me..Why was the conference call idea for such an important issue floated only in the Donor Forum. Fine, the Donors pay and they deserve to have some information. But if you need bigger participation from IV members, the conf. call idea should have been in the General Forum as well....
Anyways, can this still be arranged ? I would love to be a part of that in any possible way. Please let me and all the other members know.
This just beats me..Why was the conference call idea for such an important issue floated only in the Donor Forum. Fine, the Donors pay and they deserve to have some information. But if you need bigger participation from IV members, the conf. call idea should have been in the General Forum as well....
Anyways, can this still be arranged ? I would love to be a part of that in any possible way. Please let me and all the other members know.
more...
kaisersose
02-21 04:19 PM
Thats true. There will be supply of more 485s to the pool but that will be from EB1 and EB2 row which are always current. I guess you could reduce the 140k/year based on those numbers but since these cats are always current does it suggest there is not much demand?
Yes. Current means Supply is more than Demand.
Yes. Current means Supply is more than Demand.
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sirinme
06-11 07:34 PM
Just sent.
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jthomas
10-16 05:41 PM
I would think better than doing one day off from work let all the state chapters do a mela for diwali, distrubute flyers, educate american citizens about legal immigration, get contributions and then pass on to IV.
Lets check which state chapter can get max contributions
Rather than a flower campaign, I'd rather have no EB legal immigrants at work day where every single legal immigrant and should not go to work.
If you have or want citizenship via EB Immigration, you don't go to work for one day, say Jan 02 2009. Then people will realize that we are important to them. A lot more than Gmail (http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/10/16/194244) will be down.
Lets check which state chapter can get max contributions
Rather than a flower campaign, I'd rather have no EB legal immigrants at work day where every single legal immigrant and should not go to work.
If you have or want citizenship via EB Immigration, you don't go to work for one day, say Jan 02 2009. Then people will realize that we are important to them. A lot more than Gmail (http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/10/16/194244) will be down.
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bigboy007
06-11 04:34 PM
Why are Harkin and Sanders supporting this bill. They are both children of immigrants. They need to understand the struggle their parents went through.
There were many instances where IV tried to reach out to them, They are doing this not because they are ignorant. They are aware of the outcomes but their vision is narrowed.
There were many instances where IV tried to reach out to them, They are doing this not because they are ignorant. They are aware of the outcomes but their vision is narrowed.
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chanduv23
04-01 09:13 AM
How come these people do not get caught during H-1 approval process or during visa stamping at consulate or maybe later during GC process?
[QUOTE=chanduv23]Thats a new trend. They go to colleges and meet a group of Indian students who are about to graduate and take them out of drinks and dinner and give a presentation about their company. Then when these students come into OPT status, they are all given food + guest house accomodation. Then they are put under intense training for 2 to 3 months and made to do some mockup projects. Then their resumes are massaged with 4 to 5 years of experience ie experience from date they graduated in the under graduation and their MS education is stripped off on their resumes.
As they have Master's degrees, they go to Mexico or Canada for stamping. Thier h1b petitions are filed based on their BS/MS degrees and project works etc. and if any gaps in education, they are filled by experience. As the come under the Master's Cap, the cap lasts longer. The massaging of resumes occurs when employer sends resumes to clients and these resumes are different from what they file for h1b.
When I was trying to reqruit a junior programmer position in my company, I found it very difficult to find the right person. All these people seemed like they had fake experience, tons and tons of resumes from Desi consulting companies , these people are well trained in answering interviews and can also confuse you during the interview.
With this growing trend, the market seems to be going a bit slow for corp to corp h1b consultants and a lot of people seem to be in this category and hiring managers are having a tough time to ascertsain the validity of the candidates.
It is disheartening that this kind of activity has become extremely normal and that people are already noticing it and it does not help solve our purpose and affects those genuine job seekers and genuine hiring managers.
There is more to this. There are consulting companies like visu consultants in India that have ties with all the low grade US universities trying to fill up their grad positions with those aspiring foreign students who can pay fee upto $6000 per semester and you see hoards of people with below average or no GRE scores (GRE will be waived for some universities) filling these positions and do odd jobs inbetween college hours to pay for their next semester and these are the people who actually take loans in their country to pay the high fee, these are the same people who join consulting companies and are hungry to get into jobs by hook or crook (resume massaging) so they they can pay off their debts.
So what is happening is a rippling effect. These days a lot of good H1bs or F1s are not coming here in big numbers because of lack of funding in research or good promising jobs in home countries. People coming through education consulting and moving to jobs through consulting companies has been on rise because of this trend
[QUOTE=chanduv23]Thats a new trend. They go to colleges and meet a group of Indian students who are about to graduate and take them out of drinks and dinner and give a presentation about their company. Then when these students come into OPT status, they are all given food + guest house accomodation. Then they are put under intense training for 2 to 3 months and made to do some mockup projects. Then their resumes are massaged with 4 to 5 years of experience ie experience from date they graduated in the under graduation and their MS education is stripped off on their resumes.
As they have Master's degrees, they go to Mexico or Canada for stamping. Thier h1b petitions are filed based on their BS/MS degrees and project works etc. and if any gaps in education, they are filled by experience. As the come under the Master's Cap, the cap lasts longer. The massaging of resumes occurs when employer sends resumes to clients and these resumes are different from what they file for h1b.
When I was trying to reqruit a junior programmer position in my company, I found it very difficult to find the right person. All these people seemed like they had fake experience, tons and tons of resumes from Desi consulting companies , these people are well trained in answering interviews and can also confuse you during the interview.
With this growing trend, the market seems to be going a bit slow for corp to corp h1b consultants and a lot of people seem to be in this category and hiring managers are having a tough time to ascertsain the validity of the candidates.
It is disheartening that this kind of activity has become extremely normal and that people are already noticing it and it does not help solve our purpose and affects those genuine job seekers and genuine hiring managers.
There is more to this. There are consulting companies like visu consultants in India that have ties with all the low grade US universities trying to fill up their grad positions with those aspiring foreign students who can pay fee upto $6000 per semester and you see hoards of people with below average or no GRE scores (GRE will be waived for some universities) filling these positions and do odd jobs inbetween college hours to pay for their next semester and these are the people who actually take loans in their country to pay the high fee, these are the same people who join consulting companies and are hungry to get into jobs by hook or crook (resume massaging) so they they can pay off their debts.
So what is happening is a rippling effect. These days a lot of good H1bs or F1s are not coming here in big numbers because of lack of funding in research or good promising jobs in home countries. People coming through education consulting and moving to jobs through consulting companies has been on rise because of this trend
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03-07 08:59 AM
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BharatPremi
03-12 12:02 PM
I am worried about this financial reports. I am not sure many consulting companies will give those to employee who is leaving
Yes, I believe, most companies (new employers - mid level) would not even ask and if requested and you can not provide then generally they may not make a big deal but underlying result for asking is to check if financial strength is "Good" and I-140 is approved then no problem hiring an EAD holder.
Yes, I believe, most companies (new employers - mid level) would not even ask and if requested and you can not provide then generally they may not make a big deal but underlying result for asking is to check if financial strength is "Good" and I-140 is approved then no problem hiring an EAD holder.
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nixstor
07-05 03:47 PM
Since the sentiment is so strong against freeloaders - aren't all the people not donating to AILF freeloaders too ? Let's donate to AILF too while we are at it...
My posts were not intended towards any one particular incident. I am talking about the lack of understanding behind the website, its main agenda and what we as a community should do. It is not about for one particular incident.
My posts were not intended towards any one particular incident. I am talking about the lack of understanding behind the website, its main agenda and what we as a community should do. It is not about for one particular incident.
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dionysus
01-30 05:27 PM
May be because you opened a thread for people who recently got laid off, USCIS got the whiff.
I know this is crazy talk, but with the massive super computers, encryption cracking technologies and all that monitoring systems at the disposal of US govt, who know?
:eek:
What I am not understanding is - why are they even looking at my case now? There are 4 years of applicants ahead of me, why cant the USCIS process those applications first?
I have a sickening feeling that this is going to become more and more common in this economic situation. There must a push from above to reduce the backlogs and if they cannot approve the cases they are going to find a way to deny them on some pretext or other.
I know this is crazy talk, but with the massive super computers, encryption cracking technologies and all that monitoring systems at the disposal of US govt, who know?
:eek:
What I am not understanding is - why are they even looking at my case now? There are 4 years of applicants ahead of me, why cant the USCIS process those applications first?
I have a sickening feeling that this is going to become more and more common in this economic situation. There must a push from above to reduce the backlogs and if they cannot approve the cases they are going to find a way to deny them on some pretext or other.
dealsnet
03-19 11:12 AM
The conservative approch for the dependants is 1.2 to 1.5 times the labor approvals. Not all people have a dependants.
Husband and wife have labor approved. Like my case, my wife have labor approved, but I have file with my labor, which have older PD. Working family with husband and wife in H1B most of them have labor approved. So the actual number will be diffrent.
From the PERM statistics,
ROW adjustment should be 55% from the total number of pending cases
EB3 are 30%
If the total number of case pending with USCIS is 833,141 (all I-485 including Family based) (based on 12/31 numbers), so EB3 ROW are only 137,468. This means that with the current trend of DOS to avoid wasting GC we should expect the cut-off dates for EB3ROW to be 2006/2007.
Even if I take your figures at face value, I see a shortage of 60000 visas. This is because we need to consider that each LC will use more than one EB visa (due to family members). If I take a conservative figure that there will be one dependent for each LC candidate, we will need 200,000 EB visas for the 100,000 LCs.
Husband and wife have labor approved. Like my case, my wife have labor approved, but I have file with my labor, which have older PD. Working family with husband and wife in H1B most of them have labor approved. So the actual number will be diffrent.
From the PERM statistics,
ROW adjustment should be 55% from the total number of pending cases
EB3 are 30%
If the total number of case pending with USCIS is 833,141 (all I-485 including Family based) (based on 12/31 numbers), so EB3 ROW are only 137,468. This means that with the current trend of DOS to avoid wasting GC we should expect the cut-off dates for EB3ROW to be 2006/2007.
Even if I take your figures at face value, I see a shortage of 60000 visas. This is because we need to consider that each LC will use more than one EB visa (due to family members). If I take a conservative figure that there will be one dependent for each LC candidate, we will need 200,000 EB visas for the 100,000 LCs.
desi3933
07-09 04:13 PM
http://www.ahslaw.com/documents/AHSLawsuit.pdf
This document gives lot of legal details, states what the lawsuits exactly is..
P.S : I Think its just filed, not accepted by the court as of now
I am yet to see any legal basis in the case which states that DoS has to give notice of x days before changing the visa bulletin. All it says that they have "policy" of visa bulletin good for a month. Such policies, unless backed by legal basis, are not enforceable.
__________________
Not a legal advice.
This document gives lot of legal details, states what the lawsuits exactly is..
P.S : I Think its just filed, not accepted by the court as of now
I am yet to see any legal basis in the case which states that DoS has to give notice of x days before changing the visa bulletin. All it says that they have "policy" of visa bulletin good for a month. Such policies, unless backed by legal basis, are not enforceable.
__________________
Not a legal advice.
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